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BSAArklay
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A ‘remake’ if you will of my original Lost in Nightmares theories/observations thread. My Second attempt at trying to make sense of the events that took place pre Chris and Jill’s arrival to the European Spencer Mansion.


Mansion Original Concept

As you can see in the image above, the Lost in Nightmares mansion concept may have been taken from the original 96 Resident Evil. The painting in the office highly resembles the European mansion owned by Oswell in Lost in Nightmares.


Main Hall

First of all let’s take a look at the blood splatters in the main hall and the body count.

Once you enter the mansion you would have to be blind to miss this abomination of a mess. This texture is reused many times throughout, Resident Evil, 6 and both Revelations as well as potentially other games but since I saw it here first I am going to apply logic to this specific texture and imagine how things played out in this instance. It seems to have what I can only imagine to be claw marks or someone dragging their feet through the blood as there are stripes and streaks throughout this mess. Either Wesker killed more than one person here which doesn’t make sense due to the other puddles of blood or he did significant damage to whoever lay here (we will revisit this blood stain later). The biggest question here though is with these blood stains primarily downstairs how did all of the security team’s bodies end up upstairs?


There is a sufficient amount of blood here however not enough for someone to bleed out. It’s quite plausible that the victim did not meet his demise here, or if he did then he was quickly moved.


This however would be a sufficient enough amount of blood for someone to bleed out (notice the puddle of blood on the floor beneath the candle). It is quite easy to guess what exactly happened here. Wesker punched a security member into the candle holder who smashed his head and died on impact. There is not a body here which means they were moved from the scene of their demise.


Another puddle of blood which is another location someone may have bled out. Quite possibly Wesker punched a hole in one of the team similar to how he killed Spencer. Upon reflection the streaks in the blood make sense now. They are drag marks where the bodies were in the process of being moved. How the blood trail does not continue is a flaw however. Maybe it is just an error on Capcom’s behalf because these blood stain drag marks should lead to the stairs but you could simply just put this inaccuracy down to resources and also Capcom didn’t want to plaster the entire floor of the main hall with blood marks coming from the several stains and all the way up the stairs. Or you could just simply imagine Wesker dragged them to their feet and then hoisted the dead men onto his shoulder and carried them upstairs.


Remember the dead security guy who falls onto the stairs as you are ascending them? Well he is nowhere to be seen here. Another error on Capcom’s behalf? Or was one of these guys on the brink of death and stumbled to the banister trying to make it to his feet and toppled over, onto the stairs.


His pose certainly suggests he was reaching for something. Yes Wesker did in fact punch a hole in all of these guys and in exactly the same area upon their body. All the character models also look identical. I don’t know if it is just shadows or they are made this way on purpose to hide their features but some have very dark skin almost like they are burnt. Others are a very pale white.


Another man murdered here. I did consider that this was drag marks from Wesker moving the bodies however this is one of the 5 blood stains and removing this as the scene of a death only leaves a small blood stain which I will get to later.


A close up look at the weird shade on one of the security members faces. This is the first of the five bodies we're about to look at. This one is alone, the rest are up the small set of stairs behind Chris.


Ok so notice here how there is barely any blood aside from on the wall. That guy could have been thrown or propped there and slid down the wall creating the blood streak. I think the team bled out for quite some time before being moved here. Perhaps Wesker entered the mansion and cleared out these guys. Searched the remaining area namely Spencer’s bedroom and then returned and began the process of moving the bodies. The fourth body is in the top left you can see his legs.


So here is the small blood stain I was referring to. Again a decent amount but not enough to suggest someone was murdered here. I checked the floor below and although it is a shady area of the map I could not see any signs to suggest a puddle of blood similar to the one under the candle holder downstairs. The reason I state this is because it is exactly the same blood splatter but without the puddle below it. How did this get here? It is completely isolated from the rest of the blood stains. It almost seems like someone was shot and the blood splattered on the wall behind them. Or perhaps this is the original location where the victim of the large blood splatter downstairs began his fight. It is possible that Wesker shot the man here and threw him off the balcony and he landed in the middle of the main hall creating the large blood splatter. It is also possible that it is blood from the man who falls onto the stairs when the player first ascends them. Perhaps he was shot here and then crawled to the banister where he later fell from.


Damage to environments

This carpet has been moved from its original area obviously suggesting that there may have been a struggle here. However with no signs of blood I think that perhaps Wesker started a dash here and the carpet moved under his feet. It’s quite possible that after starting his dash here he sprinted to the top of the stairs and impaled a security team member, hence the large blood stain left atop the stairs.


Collapsed landing and the remaining debris.


So this area has taken the largest amount of damage in the mansion’s main rooms. There is no blood in this area or bodies. Originally I believed that it was possible that Wesker pounced to the balcony area and due to the force the landing gave way beneath him. Had this been recent you would assume the wooden planks would lay not only in front of the double doors below, there is debris below but it has been moved aside to access the doors. It is possible that Wesker moved these planks aside to enter the double doors. However as we know these doors are locked and require Jill entering the door to the left in the screenshot. It is quite possible that the area just collapsed and Spencer saw no need to repair the mansion with this being the least of his worries.


On either side of the main stairs there are large stands which appear to be nothing more than decorations. Opposite boards are knocked over on either side of the stairs. No blood to be found in the area around them but it's possible a security member was thrown into the boards by Wesker.


Other

So notice the size of this door and colour. Now refer to the image below and notice the size and colour. I always assumed that these two doors are one of the same. However as you can see this is impossible due to the differences.


Originally I assumed these brown double doors were the other side of the blue double doors in the Main Hall with the busted lock. It was only when comparing the two, I realised they are a different style and colour, and the brown doors are also quite slim whereas the blue ones are much wider.


However when re-watching the Shadows of the Past cut scene I noticed this second floor balcony in the library. Potentially the blue double doors could be the one on the far right, however could be a window but I feel like this is definitely the area where those blue double doors lead to. Also this area allows for alternative doors/rooms we never got to visit, only question is how do you get down from the 2nd floor, to the library?


Overall Theory of the Main Hall

It is quite clear that this area is where the majority of the fight took place. The security team had been guarding the area when an attack on the mansion took place. Five guards were situated in the Main Hall and there are six blood splatters to be found (seven if you include a very small one) however I have explained how the extra two splatters were caused.

Why were the bodies moved? My theory suggests that Wesker would have moved the bodies. So my first explanation would be that he wanted to maintain his advantage of the element of surprise. Seeing as the Security Team shows no evidence that they were armed it is plausible that Wesker used melee combat only and no gunshots were heard throughout the mansion. Wesker would not under estimate Spencer and probably expected the worst case scenarios, wanting to keep the advantage of stealth and not alerting Spencer of his presence.

Another theory would be that Wesker felt it was only a matter of time before the leak of Spencer’s whereabouts reached the likes of the BSAA, DSO or any rival companies and anticipated that he would not be the only one present that night. By hiding the bodies from plain sight it would at least buy him some extra time. The only problem with all this is sure the bodies are out of view from the main hall entrance however the mass amount of blood stains are not. Therefore moving the bodies and not clearing the blood stains is all abit of a pointless idea.

Wesker arrived at the Spencer Estate before Chris and Jill giving him the head start. The conversation between Wesker and Spencer lasted only a few minutes. However Chris and Jill would have taken at least 30 minutes to navigate the estate and that is being very generous. What Wesker was doing in this timeframe remains a puzzle in itself.

Here is why it was not the Guardians who killed the Security Team. It was suggested to me that perhaps the Guardians killed the Security Team and I have to admit due to the blood and drag marks the evidence supported this theory. I decided to re-examine the evidence and when it come to the Security Teams bodies the answer was obvious. If I can refer you to the image below and notice the damage taken to the Security Team.


As I stated earlier in my observations all Security Team members have the exact same hole in their chest which is the trademark execution that Wesker used upon Spencer and also tried this tactic on Sheva and Chris during the events of RE5. Punching a hole in their heart, the Security Team suffered an identical death to that of Spencer. Hence writing out the Guardians as the culprits indefinitely.


Alternative Security Team Theory

For the longest time I just simply assumed that this security team was Spencer’s private security. However it puzzled me as to why they were even there. Spencer left his butler go, he dismissed the only guy he trusted and relied upon. He summoned/leaked his whereabouts in order for Wesker to find him and yet he surrounds himself with security? Just did not sit right with me. So what if this Security team did not belong to Spencer and in fact were a part of the Rival Org and there to assist Wesker. When arriving at the mansion Wesker suddenly betrayed and killed them all knowing that anything he found whether it be research results or simply just information from Spencer. Wesker wanted keep this to himself and/or use this to his advantage and gift it to Tricell in order for them to gain his trust. Much like he did for the Rival Org when betraying Umbrella. Sometime after Umbrella’s End in 2003 Wesker began his communications with Tricell, at this time he was still with the Rival Org when Resident Evil 4 took place in 2004. Two years later in 2006 Lost in Nightmares happens and by the end of this year Wesker is officially with Tricell and the Rival Org have vanished. Another element to this theory is that the security unit is wearing the exact same outfit as Wesker wore in RE4 even down to the gloves. Could this outfit be a part of the Rival Org’s uniform for missions such as this? As far as the Rival Org knew they could have informed Wesker to simply go there and extract Spencer or bring him to them for questioning. But Wesker had other plans in mind. (Wesker uniform reference is credited to Welsh)


Mansion 1st floor East Wing

Moving away from the Main Hall let us look at the remaining bodies found throughout the mansion. I am just curious as to who Spencer may have killed in here. The blood appears to be very recent. Any theories that Wesker was here should be deemed impossible due to the fact that the doors are locked. If that is not enough proof let us assume Wesker was here. In this case we have to assume he would have found the files that Chris and Jill find and became aware of the truth surrounding himself and also the knowledge of Alex Wesker whom he was unware of. My guess here is a Security Team member who failed an objective he was given or perhaps wanted to leave the Mansion but Spencer could not allow this to happen. The more loyal Security Guards probably threw the ones who had cracked in there, it's not hard to imagine being trapped in this Mansion for a very long time would send them over with cabin fever. I can't imagine they would be able to come and go as they please due to Spencer being a wanted man.


This appears to have been an area used to torture and punish any victims Spencer felt had betrayed/failed him. Blood on the wall between the shackles suggest the victim was punched with their head smacking against the wall behind. The blood stains on the right could suggest claw marks where someone tried to dig at the wall in desperate attempt to escape while the ceiling is collapsing.


Empty photo frames are kept on the shelves as well as a bird cage. I compared it to the one in Remake however the changes are different. These bird cages appear to be a similar item in Spencer’s mansions. Perhaps Spencer is a bird lover?


Animal changes are also kept in storage. They seem to be large enough to hold a medium sized dog. No creature of this size can be found however.


Pet food to go along with the cages.


One of the animals potentially escaped chewing through metal bars you would have to assume the animal would have to have been infected to cause such damage to a metal cage.


1st Floor West Wing



If the player returns to the Dining Room right after the emblem has been retrieved and used on the door to the East wing hallway, piano music can be heard coming up from the piano room. However, if the player goes up to investigate, the room will still remain empty.



A smashed clock to go along with the rest of the destruction in this room.


2nd Floor East Wing



Next I looked at Spencer’s bedroom. As you can see this cabinet has been smashed to pieces. I see no lock on this cabinet so the only other reason to smash into it would be if in an immediate hurry. The medication is laid out all over the bed and night stand so my first guess would be that it was there and Spencer needed them in a hurry. Or perhaps in a fit of rage from being betrayed by Alex he threw something at it shattering the glass. The last option would be a fight broke out here and someone was thrown into it however there are no combat damage signs in this room.



As you can see the bed is in disarray with a syringe and some sort of medicine scattered across it.




The bed sheets are untidy.



My conclusion for this room is that Spencer had some sort of medical issue and perhaps had a fit or was gasping for air, perhaps Patrick or one of the Security team rushed into the room and grabbed the medication from the cabinet is such a hurry smashing the glass when opening or shutting it. Or extending that theory perhaps Spencer was asleep in bed which explains why he is wearing a robe. One of the Security team or more likely a duo came into the room knowing of Wesker or an intruder at the mansion. They hurried Spencer out of bed grabbed and some medication from the cabinet to take with them. Then they carried him across the upper main hall and into the double doors smashing the lock behind them assisting Spencer into the Library area. Perhaps these Security members are the ones found dead, outside Spencer’s library area.

October 7, 2018 at 4:17 PM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

2nd Floor West Wing

A balcony has been broken here with the carpet hanging off, I finally have an explanation for what happened here but also what was happening to Jill in the trailer.

As you can see above Chris is on the upper balcony holding Jill. Beneath Jill is the dining room table with the wooden beams, plates and placemats (Compare the tables in the pictures above & below).

So at one stage during the DLC Chris and Jill entered the upper balcony together. Meaning the collapsed landing outside this room in the main hall was probably not always collapsed. When navigating the upper balcony in the dining hall something happened to Jill and she fell off the balcony with the debris landing on the table below, Jill fell into the lower Dining Room but Chris managed to catch her just in time. I believe that Chris may have let go of Jill purposely lowering her down and breaking what could have been a nasty fall. The reason he would let go of her is so she could search the dining room area which they may not have had access to, this would cause them to split up much like in the released version and a way for Jill to open the dining room doors from the inside. All of this also explains a sentence from a file found in the lower Dining Room. “It was on the second floor of the dining hall, behind the stone statues lining the room.”

Sort of a homage to Remake don’t you think? Stone statue falling off a balcony onto a dining room table. How Jill managed to fall down after the statue is unknown. I would have actually preferred this because it's a nice homage but also more realistic than Chris throwing Jill across the broken landing.


The only object I could imagine to be inside this frame would be some sort of painting. Why it would need to be smashed to collect is a mystery. Perhaps this was part of a scrapped puzzle or simply a collectible.


Prison Area

Shackles along the wall as you ascend into the prison area. This area is actually very macabre. It seems that either Spencer or his workers were not satisfied with just testing on the subjects but they actually tortured the victims or that the Guardians broke free and turned the area into complete chaos, torturing test subjects who had been abandoned there.


A deceased subject bloodied and hung by a hook that is attached to a rope around the victims mouth. Why? Similar to Revelations 2 just post to Claire leaving her cell there similar body bags. They make no sense being there other than perhaps to scare the test subjects into obeying the workers or else end up in a bloody sack I guess.

Edit: As pointed out to me by CaptainRedfield the body bag highly resembles the one's from the jail section in Revelations 2 that Claire encounters. The same type of MO applies to both body bags here and it seem's very likely that Alex could have played a role here in some of the torture themes going on in the underground prison. Perhaps early signs of the creation of T-Phobos. (Credit: Captain Redfield)


More signs of tortue.


Ignore the body bag here. I was focusing on the giant machete. I think that is too big of a knife for a normal human to be wielding. In comparison to a man of Chris’s size it would appear to me that an average man would struggle using this weapon. Makes you wonder why Spencer would have given the Guardians weapons. Perhaps this knife came from the nearby warehouse which can be seen along the shore in the image of the Mansion on the edge of the cliff.


The upper tier of the prison cells are blocked off by the broken cell door. However as you can see the amount of cells is greatly extended if you take into account the cell’s you cannot access.


Some of the cells walls have been knocked through potentially via the Guardians in their escape, or when they came for the abandoned subjects.


Another cell door smashed off its hinges. I did entertain the idea that perhaps someone freed the Guardians however why would they then need to smash the doors off their hinges if they had been freed? It is also possible that the Guardians were never kept in these cells and they simply tore through them all when killing all the subjects inside.


Outside courtyard with a confusing centrepiece. For what purpose would anyone need that scaffolding type structure.


The room above is the exterior of the long corridor Chris and Jill walk down when approaching their confrontation with Wesker.


Bodies strung from the ceiling in this area. It appears the Guardians had taken over this area for quite some time much like the prison. What its purpose before the Guardians arrived is unknown.


Library Area on Top Floor

This is in the area where you pick up the handguns off the dead security guard after leaving the Guardians maze lair. The two guards died in the same manner as the others.


This guy’s fate is quite obvious. Wesker punched him flying through the air and he smashed into the wall behind him.


Not a whole lot noteworthy in this room other than the magical invisible table. Also the hole punched in Spencer is nowhere to be seen however we do know it should be there from the cut scene.


Layout

Just to make this easier I have added three square coloured boxes to help my explanation. The blue box I believe is the West side of the balcony, the area with the dining room and piano. The red box is the window Wesker and Jill fall out of. If you check the cut scene you can see the same window as well as the rocky cliffs. That would make the white square the long narrow curved corridor Chris and Jill walk through just outside the library.

Note the windows on the roof of the mansion. The mansion has an attic we never find. Possibly this could be accessed from the upper balcony in the library.


Photos and Paintings

Scratched out woman’s face perhaps a member of Spencer’s family.


A portrait of Spencer. He seems to be in better health here.


Another empty frame this one being a centrepiece above the fireplace must have been of importance.


Photographs from his trips to Africa.


What appears to be the Temple from Resident Evil 5.


The stairway of the sun. After Jill and Wesker had disappeared you would imagine the BSAA would confiscate these photos.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 7, 2018 at 4:38 PM Flag Quote & Reply

USS Command
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Posts: 442

Very nice read! I really like the idea that the security are with the Organization. Maybe they got sent in to check out the place and retrieve Spencer without Wesker's involvement and when he found out about the leak he went there himself found them and killed them all to keep any of the discoverers to himself or for when he jumps to Tricell.

Great obvservatipn with the trailer, the balcony and that file.

It's stated the Guardians got the anchors from a warehouse by some docks right? That place underground could've been where things was carried from that warehouse to the mansion.

I always thought the frame above the fire place looked like the wooded thing from remake you use to get the 2nd floor map.

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"I'll take my Survival Horror like I take my men" - George Trevor, September 3, 2017 at 6:10 PM
"I am so in love with CHE I almost put my willy in the USB port." George Trevor, September 20, 2018 at 12:53 PM
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October 7, 2018 at 9:00 PM Flag Quote & Reply

ResiEvilChic96
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Posts: 344

There are some pretty cool theories on this and appreciate the time you took to get all this together, BSAArklay, great job! 
Neat find where you see Jill dangling on the balcony of the dining room and there is nothing on the table below her but the place mats and candlestick holders and then in the actual game you see the wooden pieces of the floor and other debris on the table in the dining room. I can see that if they kept that scene of jill dangling, that it was meant for her to explore the area.

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October 7, 2018 at 10:15 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Evil Resident
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Posts: 145
Fantastic observations. I'd like to add that Spencer was a sadist, and seemed to enjoy tormenting others as a pass time. That's why both his mansions are filled with impractical traps and shackles. He also toyed with George Trevor instead of just killing him, and his taste in artwork reflects his sadism, particularly towards women. I think the prison was originally just his own personal torture chamber, which he simply repurposed for his last ditch experiments. This explains the strung up corpses, and some of those blood splatters could have been older and not from his security at all.
--
Hiding places are beyond number, and yet only one deliverance. But there are as many chances for deliverance as there are hiding places - Kafka
October 8, 2018 at 8:02 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Captain Redfield
Member
Posts: 5

Great stuff as usual!

I'm really looking forward buddy, if you need anything just let me know :)


October 8, 2018 at 9:45 AM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

Thanks for the great feedback everyone. I added some edits to the thread one great contribution in particular from Captain Redfield:


"Edit: As pointed out to me by CaptainRedfield the body bag highly resembles the one's from the jail section in Revelations 2 that Claire encounters. The same type of MO applies to both body bags here and it seem's very likely that Alex could have played a role here in some of the torture themes going on in the underground prison. Perhaps early signs of the creation of T-Phobos. (Credit: Captain Redfield)"


The tortue chamber area makes so much more sense now. When writing for this area I could not really imagine why this area had such themes and simply believed it to be the Guardians of Insanity but it make's much more sense now that this was where Alex began her work on the creation of T-Phobos and her torturing of the test subjects allowed her to gather research data for the virus.


Yeah good point USS Command it is very likely that some of the environments are filled with items the Guardians brought back from their trips to the warehouse, perhaps that explains where the giant knife came from.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 8, 2018 at 10:11 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Captain Redfield
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Posts: 5

Glad I could help! Alex did live or at least visited the Estate for quite a while before moving to Sushestvovanie. Those bodybags having the exact same MO as the ones we found in Revelations 2 just makes everything come together.

Both Spencer and Alex enjoyed torturing people as far as we know but I'm going to say that she learned that from her "father". The ones found in LIN were victims of Spencer and Alex's experiments together in the Estate, while the ones found in Revelations 2 were the work of Alex and her researchers, keeping the same MO of torturing test subjects to create this new virus that could "see" through people's fears.

October 8, 2018 at 10:17 AM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

Very nice information Capt. Thank's so much for adding this, I was really stumped on why the torture themes I know it's Spencer and all but I just wasn't buying that he had the time to care about doing this type of thing due to his desperation on trying to create an Immortality virus. But now we have an exact explanation for why the torture themes occured. Very cool I need to revisit this DLC now with a whole new perspective. Also excellent link between Alex and Spencer and how he had been the motivation for her sadistic torture fetish. RE5 is the game that just keeps on giving.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 8, 2018 at 10:32 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Weskers Report
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Posts: 34
Unused 96 concept art matches the mansion - thatĀ?s awesome. Interesting on the security men there being the Rival Co. No punctured hole wound in SpencerĀ?s heart area? What did he inject himself with... Maybe he had healing properties? IĀ?m not saying he upped and left after everyone was gone but perhaps that wound healed. Alex torturing subjects in the catacombs area - nice touch! Maybe Trevor was a bird fanatic and not so much Spencer? Bird cages look the same in RE7 too. Could be Bakers purchased them from Trevor & Chamberlain? I know itĀ?s a stretch as they were a construction company but nothing wrong with theorizing. Wish we could explore the other cells and the attic. Fantastic work man.
October 8, 2018 at 7:15 PM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

Thanks WR appriciate you taking the time to read it. Just a theory about Spencer's men I am not sure there is any official materials out there that even mention who they are so something I need to look into. I think Spencer is just an over sight on Capcom's behalf but it's pretty sloppy especially considering how they took the time to add the damage to the security team so would have been easy to just copy the same damage to Spencer.


Yeah could be Trevor too but Trevor didn't designed the European Mansion. He simply took inspiration from there and used it for Arklay. This mansion was around long before Trevor's time as Spencer recalls growing up there. It belonged to the Spencer family.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 9, 2018 at 12:46 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Evil Resident
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Posts: 145
While I do think Alex may have learned some of her perversions from Spencer, I don't think she ever performed experiments at his home. Her immortality research (which became Kodoku research) was performed in an actual lab on the HI island, while the Estate experiments were primitive and desperate. t-Phobos was developed by a research team at the Rev2 island, not by Alex herself at Spencer's home.
--
Hiding places are beyond number, and yet only one deliverance. But there are as many chances for deliverance as there are hiding places - Kafka
October 9, 2018 at 7:23 PM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
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Posts: 790

Well the test subjects are there for a purpose. Make's sense to me that Spencer wasn't able to travel far due to his health and warrants. Why not have a research lab right under his feet? He probably wanted to keep tabs on Alex and her progress. Only when she concieved her own agenda did she probably request a larger lab. I can see early stages of the research taking place there. Not suggesting t-Phobos was created there I am saying early stages began there.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 9, 2018 at 7:44 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Captain Redfield
Member
Posts: 5

It's simple, Alex just started performing experiments at the Estate. Spencer was always searching for this supposed virus but by the time his health started to decrease he wished more expedient results and sent Alex to Sonido de Tortuga.


October 9, 2018 at 8:52 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Evil Resident
Moderator
Posts: 145
But Alex's experiments involving human torture were based around how tPhobos reacts to fear. The prison she uses in Rev2 is just where she tests the virus developed in her lab in the mines. We never even see a lab at the Spencer Estate. Spencer enjoyed torturing people, and even Marcus used torture equipment in his T experiments, so Spencer having mutilated and strung up corpses lying around fits his MO. I don't think he performed Progenitor research at his home prior to the Blob experiments at all, instead using his second house in Arklay to keep his family home a secret haven.
--
Hiding places are beyond number, and yet only one deliverance. But there are as many chances for deliverance as there are hiding places - Kafka
October 9, 2018 at 9:38 PM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

So what if Patrick was the one who continued Spencer/Alex's research into the immortality virus? By subjecting test subjects to torture after infecting them with the latest version of the virus Spencer had recieved from Alex. "It has been one week since I administered the virus at Lord Oswell's instructions" and "and the screaming echoes throughout my entire body." So perhaps it was Patrick via Spencer who continued to research following orders from Spencer.


There must be a lab there for Patrick to continue the research, like mentioned above there is an attic area we never get to see. In the Arklay Lab there is Hunter tubes that we never get to see. Also I am not sure Spencer did enjoy torture so much as he did mind games. I feel like Spencer enjoyed puzzles, traps and psychological mind games as opposed to straight up gruesome torture. Putting people in body bags, stabbing someone with hooks and chopping them up doesn't really fit his MO. That is more Alex as seen in Revelations 2, it's much more macrbe and sadistic.


Even consider the Blobs other name. "Guardians of Insanity" That sounds like something straight out of Kafka to me. I think there has to be some element of Alex's research in that underground area wether it was Alex/her team or even Patrick eitherway someone was experimenting of test subjects and using a MO extremely similar to her research on T-Phobos in Rev2.

--

"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 9, 2018 at 10:23 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Captain Redfield
Member
Posts: 5

But that's were everything comes together EvilResident, something must have peaked Alex's interest towards torturing people for the sake of research and that more than likely happened during her stay at the Estate or when she visited Spencer.

No one here is saying that T-Phobos started at the Estate but Alex's MO of torturing people. In their own twisted mind, torturing people probably was a way of achieving immortality, if your body can endure all types of pain and torture that could probably mean you were worthy of being immortal. Spencer's body was being tortured from the inside out by the disease of age, using that type of MO actually makes sense considering his goal, which in turn influenced Alex.

Alex just pursued her own thing soon after but those experiments at the basement clearly had her hand there. Patrick didn't torture people, he merely infected them and left them to die.

October 10, 2018 at 2:19 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Evil Resident
Moderator
Posts: 145
Patrick's experiments were extremely primitive. He was a butler, not a scientist. As far as we can tell, he seemed to just inject dozens of prisoners with the virus and hoped one would adapt and produce a weakened strain. As I said in my G Analysis, I think the virus used on the Blobs was the prototype G recovered from Lisa, which is an old virus, not something new and cutting edge, let alone something related to Alex. Both of Spencer's homes are filled with torture devices and shackles, even before Progenitor research ever began. The whole prison looks like a giant torture chamber. He also has a taste in artwork depicting violence towards women. Alex got the idea to torture victims after a researcher of her's discovered the first strain of t-Phobos which responded to fear. That along with her relationship with Albert and the mind transfer requirements led to her Kafka fascination. She could have gotten her macabre fascination from Spencer too. Having mutilated corpses and torture equipment isn't exclusive to Alex, as Marcus performed experiments in a torture chamber himself.
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Hiding places are beyond number, and yet only one deliverance. But there are as many chances for deliverance as there are hiding places - Kafka
October 10, 2018 at 6:11 AM Flag Quote & Reply

BSAArklay
Administrator
Posts: 790

Well I am just suggesting an alternative here because you don't think it was Alex or her team so then who and why? The Guardians purpose is a whole other discussion I have no idea why they were there but I do think their name has elements of Kafka in it. Where in Remake is there torture devices? Those are traps/puzzles, there is one pair of shackles that don't relate to Lisa Trevor. Again there is a big difference between puzzles/traps and tying someone up in a body bag and hanging them from the rafters, or pining someone to a table and stabbing them multiple times. There is nothing like that in the Arklay mansion. The pictures with violence toward women could mean that he was a misogynist. I am not suggesting that Spencer didn't have a fetish for this stuff but I think Alex is on a whole other level, almost like she saw Spencer's fetish and went completely over the top with it.


Let's take a look at further evidence here. Patrick say's that very early on even when his health was only just deteriorating that Spencer was spending more and more time in his room. He didn't even have the time to repair the upper landing in the main hall. He had one goal and that was trust and follow Alex's research into the immortality virus. He didn't have time for some torture fetish just for kicks. He wasn't eating and could barely get out of bed or his wheelchair. It just doesn't make sense that he would be having people tortured when he wasn't even there to see it. Also who do you suggest was doing this stuff if not Alex or Patrick?


"I've assisted with many experiments so far" That tell's me that Patricks involvement was beyond primitive.


He must have been receving research reports from the work and when Alex abandoned him he tried to continue the research himself picking up from the last report he recieved from Alex.


"Alex excels at absorbing the abilities of others." If Alex absorbs others abilities then it is not hard to imagine that she is quite impressionable. She saw Spencer's fetish for medievil traps, torture etc and became obsessed.


"I gave Alex subordinates and a research site." It wasn't until his second memoirs that he gave Alex the funding and a research site. Perhaps before this time the research was already underway and they were experimenting with different viruses at Spencer home. Just take a look at this line "Taking the researchers, equipment and several hundred test subjects, Alex went there." Which proves that before they went to the island that they were already working upon an Immortality virus, much like I suggested early research began before Spencer even invested in funding her on the island. Obviously the research became to big to be ran from his underground prison/labs and they had to vacate possibly a suggestion made by Alex to get out from Spencers grasp.

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"I've had enough of your bullshit! Your just another one of Umbrella's leftovers"

October 10, 2018 at 9:11 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Evil Resident
Moderator
Posts: 145
I agree that Alex may have learned some of her perversions from Spencer, but that doesn't mean she literally tortured people at his private residence. The traps at Arklay aren't very practical, and seem more like they were designed to kill people in different and creative ways. The bird cage staircase is lined with shackles, and certain puzzles are macabre in nature, like the Death Masks. Not to mention how he prolonged Trevor's suffering for no apparent reason other than entertainment. The corpses at his estate could either be old, or a result of Patrick and Spencer experimenting with the prisoners like Marcus did. Compare it to the barbaric "experiments" performed at concentration camps during the Holocaust, which were just as much about scientific curiosity as they were about satisfying sick perversions. After infecting prisoners, Spencer could have ordered them to be tortured to test their vitality. The fact some were strung up afterwards was probably just a sick fancy, as they would serve no practical purpose that way. The corpses strung up in a similar way in Rev2 may actually have been the doing of the Afflicted, who also made outfits from human skin. Similiarly, the Blobs could have contributed to the decor of the estate. Patrick was a butler, and "assistance" doesn't strike me as anything more than moving bodies and injecting people. Especially as this immediately follows in that file "I don't know how useful a butler without any scientific knowledge is, but Lord Oswell's turned a suspicious eye on everything and opens his heart only to me now; so I should be proud to assist." I personally just don't see it as enough to suggest Alex did anything at the estate, and see the experiments performed there as being crude, in order to drive home how Spencer was driven to his last extremity. He betrayed everyone, and so everyone betrayed him, until all he had was a simple butler, old virus samples, and a prison to try and stop his impending death. That's just what makes the most sense in my mind.
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Hiding places are beyond number, and yet only one deliverance. But there are as many chances for deliverance as there are hiding places - Kafka
October 10, 2018 at 11:43 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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