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Forum Home > BIRKIN'S LABORATORY > Albert Wesker v Morpheus Duvall

Albert Wesker 187
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Posts: 124



Hello all Crimson Head Elder residents  I have created this topic because I want to get everyones feedback there was a Crimson Head Elder Resident that said quote "Morpheus Duvall  what I believe to be RE's most fascinating and most suited characters to be an entire series antagonist, far superior in every way to Wesker." However, I disagree with this arguement I would like to hear everyones opinions regarding this situation do you all believe that Morpeus Duvall is a better suited antagonist than Albert Wesker? or vice versa or is their another antagonist that you all believe would better be suited? Looking forward to hearing everybody else responses.

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"The only thing that can defeat power is more power. That is the one constant in this universe. However, there is no point in power if it consumes itself. I will enlist the help of an old friend against our common foe; I will use one pawn to eliminate the other, and emerge with the spoils for myself... "

October 26, 2014 at 12:33 AM Flag Quote & Reply

CC
Moderator
Posts: 113

Morpheus Duvall for me is in league with the fictitious Buffalo Bill from Silence of the Lambs. As disturbing as he was I don’t label him as a truly great villain. Albert Wesker is far greater in my opinion, but beyond that is the man who made him. His, as I put it, surrogate father - Ozwell Spencer. If I could, to illustrate my point, draw your attention to one of America’s most infamous serial killers, H.H. Holmes. While he was building his castle of fear he would hire a construction crew to build a section and then he would fire them. Then he would hire a new crew to build another section then fire them, and so on and so on. So no one man, except himself, knew the full layout. Ozwell Spencer on the other hand hired George Trevor to build his mansion. Then he didn’t just kill him - he tortured him. Spencer used his family as experiments that easily rival Japan’s Unit 731’s actions. Trevor was psychologically tortured, which in my eyes is worse than physical torture. In the end George had to have realized his family’s fate. And this is just one example of Spencer’s insidious character. He was truly an evil man. It has been theorized somewhere, presently I couldn’t tell you where, that Spencer had something to do with Ashford’s “accident”. I would not put this past him. If we were to see everything that Spencer planned and had a hand in I think we would see a very efficient antagonist.

October 26, 2014 at 2:52 AM Flag Quote & Reply

USS Command
Moderator
Posts: 442

I'm going to have to say Morpheus Duvall is better.

Now don't get me wrong I like Wesker and all but honestly he was basically programed the way he was while Morpheus did everything on his own.

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"I'll take my Survival Horror like I take my men" - George Trevor, September 3, 2017 at 6:10 PM
"I am so in love with CHE I almost put my willy in the USB port." George Trevor, September 20, 2018 at 12:53 PM
“Great love springs from great knowledge of the beloved object and if you know it but a little, you will be able to love it only a little or not at all.” - Leonardo da Vinci

October 26, 2014 at 8:45 AM Flag Quote & Reply

TheBatMan
Moderator
Posts: 308

Wesker wasn't programmed. He had complete free will. All he was implanted with was a subliminal desire to seek out Spencer. All his actions throughout the series were his own.

Morpheus Duvall is the worst villain in the entire series for me. No personality, ridiculous plan, useless at his job and he wasn't in the least bit intimidating.

October 26, 2014 at 11:18 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Albert Wesker 187
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Posts: 124

I agree with TheBatMan in this situation although Morpheus to me was a very intriguing character. To me Wesker was just the perfect antagonist, he was a complete and utter badass and he was a very intimidating individual, and his philosophy was magnificient as well. I do not think there is/was a better suited antagonist than Albert Wesker in the entire Resident Evil universe.

--

"The only thing that can defeat power is more power. That is the one constant in this universe. However, there is no point in power if it consumes itself. I will enlist the help of an old friend against our common foe; I will use one pawn to eliminate the other, and emerge with the spoils for myself... "

October 27, 2014 at 10:37 PM Flag Quote & Reply

NEMESIS
Member
Posts: 183

TheBatMan at October 26, 2014 at 11:18 AM

Wesker wasn't programmed. He had complete free will. All he was implanted with was a subliminal desire to seek out Spencer. All his actions throughout the series were his own.

Morpheus Duvall is the worst villain in the entire series for me. No personality, ridiculous plan, useless at his job and he wasn't in the least bit intimidating.

I don't agree with this, sorry TheBatMan because I usually agree with what you have to say on the series. Morpheus is my favorite Resident Evil villian after Spencer, because I experienced fear with his stalking approach that was similar to Nemesis hunting S.T.A.R.S. members and he had a personality that transcended the actual gameplay very strongly on its own, as a separate theme. I dont agree that he has no personality either, because he has a very distinct personality that distinguishes him from most other RE boss guys - who else had his obsession with a theme that was so different from the usual generic bad guy characteristics? I also cannot agree with a dumb plan equating to a criticism in the sense that I challenge you to come up with a RE villain that did not have a ridiculous plan that went terribly wrong! Also being useless at his job is not a measure of how much of a great character he was, because this would rule out all the RE enemies - they all sucked at preventing outbreaks & extending life with a quick virus upgrade!!

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STAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRS

October 28, 2014 at 7:05 PM Flag Quote & Reply

George Trevor
Site Owner
Posts: 1087

It wont come as much of a surprise that I very much agree with NEMESIS. So sorry I couldn't resist ~


QUOTE Angus Waycott (Actor for Morpheus D. Duvall) :


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PLEASE NOTE : This is an edited & shortened version of Angus Waycott's full answer, during the first ever interview that he has agreed to conduct regarding his Resident Evil acting, exclusively for the Crimson Head Elder Podcast File #2 - Halloween Special. Mr Waycott offers considerable detail, with refrences to Western and Japanese history & culture, as to why Morpheus is such a significant & interesting character, and also on the influence of the geography of Japan on the development of Ghost stories into their own popular culture, and how those socially pervading narratives affect video games like Resident Evil ~


http://www.crimson-head.com/apps/forums/topics/show/13046244-angus-waycott-interview


And regarding why I disagree with TheBatman and Albert Wesker 187, my short answer would be ~


QUOTE George Trevor : "Morpheus's life mission, as detailed in his uniquely peculiar mantra, and significantly, the methods he employs to realise that goal, strongly suggests an affliction to a specific personality disorder, with narcissism as the route cause. Many of the symptoms associated with this narcissistic disorder are on display, as Morpheus resorts to escalating levels of extreme behaviour ~ the pursuit of purely selfish and unrealistic goals, two symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder expressed through Morpheus's personal mantra; the exploitation of others to reach one's goal, a symptom evidenced when Morpheus takes advantage of Umbrella and its staff to further the construction of his missile silo; exaggeration of personal importance, a symptom clearly evident by the extraordinarily vain conclusion that he is a messiah, chosen to establish a revolutionary world-order of beauty; complete lack of empathy, a symptom initially evidenced by Morpheus's total disregard for staff safety at the hand of his distraction from supervision, and then horrendously displayed in the massacre of his own followers.

Bound by his narcissistic personality disorder (NPD), Morpheus would be slave to an extremely perverted value system; one that would drive him to realise his dream for perfection, by severely questionable means. Doomed by his NPD, Morpheus’s consciousness would have little time for anything else outside this ideal, being excessively preoccupied by this disorder's fatal mix of personal adequacy, power, prestige, and vanity.

The individual causes of NPD are unknown, but various theories have been proposed by research psychologists. One suggested cause I believe relates directly to Morpheus; that being the manifestation of a defence mechanism. A theory developed further from this principle, that NPD relates to a defence mechanism against intense feelings of shame, is exemplified by the ultimate lengths that Morpheus resorts to, in countering his self-loathing. The victim of intense shame, Morpheus exacts the ultimate defence mechanism, physically manifested with extreme plastic surgery, clearly evidenced prior to his mutation, despite those disagreeing who refuse to see what is right in front of them, poking through his trenchcloak. That he would look to such dramatically permanent mutilation is telling; it is this extremity, an expression of Morpheus's defence mechanism to counter intolerable personal shame, that evidences his own source for a NPD.

Narcissists like Morpheus Duvall have such an elevated sense of self-worth, that they value themselves as inherently superior to all others. Yet, they have a fragile self-esteem, and cannot handle criticism, often trying to compensate for this inner fragility by belittling, or disparaging others in an attempt to validate their own self-worth. This comparable dim view for his peers, will fuel Morpheus's pursuit of human physical perfection, a desire articulated by his mantra on beauty. In expressing, and attempts to fulfil this personal mantra, born of narcissism, Morpheus would devise a tyrannical goal, blinded by this fervent obsession with beauty. Such a passionate vision would require a powerful sponsor, and Morpheus knew just the corporation with the resources to realise his perverted plan. Such was the motivation that lead Morpheus to target Umbrella; this was a plan already formulated, rather than developed at a later date, from a rage caused by his dismissal. With the ethically barren laboratories, and morally free science of Umbrella, Morpheus had an employer that could provide him with the vicious tools required."


And my long answer would be ~ http://www.crimson-head.com/heroesneverdie.htm



October 28, 2014 at 7:31 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Albert Wesker 187
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Posts: 124

Although I agree with Angus Wycott, George Trevor, and NEMESIS on certain points like the fact that Morpheus Duvall did not show any emotion towards anything or anybody unlike Albert Wesker who despised Chris with every inch of his being what I do not agree with is the fact that Morpheus was focused on his appeareance he wanted to look like a woman because that is what beauty is I understand because Lord knows women are beautiful in every way. However, unlike Like Wesker, Wesker was not focused on his appeareance he was focused on his mission as we all know by his philosophy "A spies obligation and priority is the mission to carry out the mission like a machine without any emotional interference." Wesker was also narcissist and cynic as well Wesker had a God complex as well he believed that "Everyday humans come one step closer to self destruction I am not destroying the world I am saving it". So basically I am not saying that Morpheus Duvall was not a great antagonist he was but Wesker was far superior to him because Wesker was always focused on his mission if you think about it Morpheus Duvall resembled Sergei Vladimir on so many levels.

--

"The only thing that can defeat power is more power. That is the one constant in this universe. However, there is no point in power if it consumes itself. I will enlist the help of an old friend against our common foe; I will use one pawn to eliminate the other, and emerge with the spoils for myself... "

October 28, 2014 at 10:28 PM Flag Quote & Reply

Yuan-The-11th
Moderator
Posts: 140

I prefer Morpheus Duvall.

 

In a lot of ways I find that he was the physical manifestation of Umbrella Corporation, here is merely one example:

 

RE2 Wanted Ad excerpt:

"WHAT ARE WE LOOKING FOR?

We're looking for healthy, dedicated, and single individuals of any race, religion, or sex"

 

By there own admission, Umbrella Corporation did no discriminate when it came to gender but what game is it that best displays this?

 

RE Dead Aim, seriously play RE Dead Aim and look at how many of the seabed laboratory/biosphere staff members employed by Morpheus where women and then look at every other game in the entire series, in comparison it is clear that Morpheus provided a haven for women wishing to be bio-weapon researchers, so Morpheus was not male chauvinist, sexist or misogynist.

 

This fact above alone makes Morpheus a very unique antagonist to me and I feel that it was traits such as this that provided Morpheus a cult-like following as he had many followers who where willing to risk there lives for him wears Ozwell and Albert had absolutely no one willing to die for them when their time came.

 

The cult-like flowing when combined with the way he viewed himself suggests to me that Morpheus had a messiah complex where he believed that he must at all costs improve the world in face of various injustices he had seen in his life, wears Ozwell and Albert had a god complex and wished to destroy the world then replace it with one that completely revolves around them.

 

I also believe that Morpheus had a much more modest and possible plan, creating a small kingdom or perhaps more accurately, a small warlord state in say: central Africa would not be that hard to some one who is both rich and ruthless enough to pursue such objective wears Ozwell and Albert literally wanted both to control the entire globe and to replace human beings with a new race, somehow they both believed that they could archive this goal in their lifespan.

 

Also Morpheus was not born with a silver spoon in his mouth unlike Ozwell E. Spencer and Albert Wesker, Morpheus is very similar to Dr. Julius No in that way as he had humble beginnings in life but was able to make his own powerful criminal organization and even bullied entire governments.

 

So, yes, I prefer Morpheus Duvall over Albert Wesker.

--

 The nobility will rise again. Until that time, farewell!

October 29, 2014 at 3:09 AM Flag Quote & Reply

TheBatMan
Moderator
Posts: 308

Good for you guys for defending Morpheus but he's just never, ever resonated with me. There's just nothing to him. He's obsessed with beauty and cleanliness which right there is a massive weakness to exploit and is evident in the game as it led to the accident on the island. 

As a villain he's also not in the least bit threatening and ive always found it odd that Dead Aim fatally wounds him in the intro sequence, taking away even more of his threat.

And a trans-gender Tyrant, come on... Interesting idea but how can anyone take a high-heel wearing Tyrant seriously. 

And Yuan, how do you know Morpheus was not born with a silver spoon in his mouth? We know so little about his background, which is another reason I find him so boring. I also think your barking up the wrong tree with the female researcher angle. It's just reused models of female passengers from the Spencer Rain for the most part. There's nothing in the files or storyline that suggests his penchant for women either. At the end of the day it's all just speculation, which we as fans are forced to theorise with, because Capcom gave us no meat for the character.


For me, the real strengths of Dead Aim is all the behind the scenes stuff, Umbrella's recovery plan and the secret B.O.W. auction on the ship. But as for Morpheus, I don't believe for a second the series would be any weaker without him.


October 29, 2014 at 4:25 AM Flag Quote & Reply

Yuan-The-11th
Moderator
Posts: 140

Regarding Morpheus and silver spoons:

Morpheus did not have the money needed to achieve his plans hence the whole ransom deal, Ozwell always had the money to carry out his plans "a world famous milliner", Albert Wesker was giving the best possible education by Project W. and was giving preferential treatment by Ozwell, "I want the Nemesis Parasite even though it is made by Umbrella Europe!" "Okay son, here you go!".

 

Regarding female researchers:

I am reading to much into gameplay by the fact that the model of the female passengers was re-used to make the female researchers?

Models get reused all the time, I do not see the importance of this.
May as well assume that the male researchers are all clones, they all look the same after all.

Nothing to suggest that Morpheus employs women?

He says that beauty should be placed above all, seeing as how most nations on this planet believe that women are more beautiful, it is logical that he would prefer women in his ranks.

I am not saying that Morpheus is some kind of pro-feminist if that is what anyone got from my post, rather that by employing women into his ranks in an otherwise sausage fest series, Morpheus is instantly more unique from other antagonists.


There was almost nothing unique about Albert Wesker's style, another comic book villain who personality can be summarized by God-complex, world domination and eugenics.

A beauty worshiping cult that conducts corporate terrorism on the other hand is quite unique at least in comparison.

 

At the end of the day though, I am probably not going to see eye to eye with anyone who only takes the Japanese script into consideration and completely disregards gameplay as I deal with Resident Evil as opposed to Bio Hazard and the gameplay is part of the story to me.

It is a simply difference in opinion and preferences.

--

 The nobility will rise again. Until that time, farewell!

October 29, 2014 at 5:27 AM Flag Quote & Reply

TheBatMan
Moderator
Posts: 308
Morpheus required $10 billion dollars for his plan as I recall. Not many people will have access to that kind of money, even Spencer was only a millionaire after all. Morpheus is a well spoken man and obsessed with his appearance and had cosmetic surgery. There is nothing to suggest he didn't have a prestigious upbringing. Short answer regarding female researchers, you've answered your own question. Yes models are reused, nothing obvious at all to suggest Morpheus favoured women. I'm not dismissing your claim, there's just no evidence for it. There's actually evidence to suggest Spencer favoured women. There are sculptures and statues all over the training facility depicting women watching your character. a painting in James marcus's office depicts 'a woman watching over a dead man.' all the art frescoes in the lecture theatre depict women, then there's the numerous paintings at Arklay mansion. I have exactly the same view on the series as you do believe it or not. Yes I like to refer to the Japanese to check for accuracy and mistakes, but at the end of the day I play Resident Evil not Biohazard and of course I theorise and speculate on gameplay and atmosphere. But at the same time I can't say well Morpheus is more interesting than Wesker because he wasn't born rich and preferred to employ women because we don't know that he did. It's just speculation. We know so little about him, hence why he is one of the less memorable antagonists.
October 29, 2014 at 8:55 AM Flag Quote & Reply

M-Greg
Moderator
Posts: 82

I love Wesker. But I think Morpheus' appeal lies heavily in the fact that we do know so little about him. With Wesker, we have everything laid out on the table. There are really no more interesting questions to ask about him. Morpheus could be fleshed out more if they wanted to flesh him out more, though.

--

The basis of controlling fear... Only those who've conquered fear deserve to rule the world.

November 2, 2014 at 11:11 PM Flag Quote & Reply

James Marcus
Member
Posts: 226

M-Greg at November 2, 2014 at 11:11 PM

I love Wesker. But I think Morpheus' appeal lies heavily in the fact that we do know so little about him. With Wesker, we have everything laid out on the table. There are really no more interesting questions to ask about him. Morpheus could be fleshed out more if they wanted to flesh him out more, though.

The intrigue is what gets me going when it comes to Morpheus. Wesker is a cliché and a bad one at that. M-Greg yes I agree with you here, the saturation of Wesker often grates on me and Morpheus exists on the sidelines, sometimes out of reach when you try to discover more about him from source materials. The Angus Waycott interview was a tremendous opportunity to learn more about this unusual character who provides more intrigue than Wesker IMO. Angus Waycott telling of his connection with Dr No and the traits of his character that developed from this background are similar to Wesker's - arrogance, a cold aloofness, but Morpheus brings them together into a far more intriguingly interesting & unique character as compared to the more cliché Wesker.

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I will have my revenge on Umbrella!

November 3, 2014 at 6:56 PM Flag Quote & Reply

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